- This topic has 6 replies, 4 voices, and was last updated 11 years, 10 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
Thaijim
…I am curious to know how or what is used to measure alkalinity…?
Jim
Thank you, Jim, for raising that question. It's been on MY mind for some time. As a matter of fact, there are several questions:
1) How does one measure, relatively accurately, alkalinity (pH) of urine, stomach acid, saliva, body?
2) What impact does the pH of the various items mentioned have on the well-being or ill-being of a person?
3) How does/can one control and/or change the various pH's?
4) What significance does a “high” or “low” pH have?
5) What is the “recommended” healthy pH to achieve and/or maintain a healthy body/life???
That is the million dollar question guys, and in truty I think it will remain pretty much answerless.
Acid is defined as an excess of hydrogen ions over hydroxyl ions and alkalinity the opposite. It can be measured in the food we eat and the by products we elimiinate. The body maintains blood at a constant pH (Hydrogen potential) of 7.4 give or take almost nothing.
Okay that's really it scientifically but then we have New Age, the people who give you acupuncture, chakras, shiatsu and mega-vitamin cures for all disease. They turned acid-base on its head and now it can mean anything any particular author wants it to mean. Thus lemon juice can be acid, base, or both?
To my way of thinking, the only effect of all this on gout is for those people who form urate kidney stones indicative of an acidic urine in the presence of lots of uric acid. For them eating alkaline foods and taking alkaline drugs as measured scientifically is useful.
Other than that, I leave acid-alkaline discussion to the new-age gurus peddling their latest paperbacks at Barnes and Noble.
hansinnm said:
Thaijim
…I am curious to know how or what is used to measure alkalinity…?
Jim
Thank you, Jim, for raising that question. It's been on MY mind for some time. As a matter of fact, there are several questions:
1) How does one measure, relatively accurately, alkalinity (pH) of urine, stomach acid, saliva, body?
Zip has already mentioned that body pH (i.e. blood) is maintained pretty constantly. The mechanism is a little beyond me, but has much to do withe storing/relasing the aforementioned hydrogen ions in various bits of the body (wish I'd done more than disect frogs in biology class). Stomach acid is not something you could measure. Urine and saliva can be measured with pH papers or electronic meters.
2) What impact does the pH of the various items mentioned have on the well-being or ill-being of a person?
Though there are definitely a few new-agers who claim pH affects everything, there is a strong body of evidence to show that there are health effects. This is way beyond the scope of this site, but be very careful where you look for extra info. I have found pHbalance to be pretty well balanced, but I have not checked all their sources. Stick to claims that can be verified in PubMed.
3) How does/can one control and/or change the various pH's?
Eat properly! Protein and phosphorous are acidifying. Potassium, magnesium, and calcium are alkalyzing. You need all of those, but in the right balance. Learn about PRAL,follow the links, then ask more questions. If you are at risk medically from acidosis (or whatever the opposite is called, you usually get treated with baking soda (or whetever cures the opposite).
4) What significance does a “high” or “low” pH have?
It depends very much on context. The significance for gout sufferers is that uric acid forms crystals more readily when pH is lower. The only fluid you can really influence is urine, which is significant for risk of stone formation. Untreated gouties can alkalize urine to avoid uric acid kidney stones. Allopurinol takers can alkalize urine to avoid oxypurinol stones.
5) What is the “recommended” healthy pH to achieve and/or maintain a healthy body/life???
6.5 to 7.5 for urine, but best to read the link at the bottom of the pHbalance page I referred to earlier. This explains how pH changes during the day and what ranges are good to aim for.
One thing that is very important to watch for is that there are thousands of sites that repeat totally unfounded information about pH. Besides general confusion in the struggle to sell something worthless, there are 2 specific points which people just get wrong.
Myth #1. pH of food is important. No it is not. It makes as much sense as “if you eat yeast and shoe polish, next day you will rise and shine”. The alkalizing comes from minerals in the food and the way they combine with hydrogen atoms. Citric acid, acetic acid and any of the other dietary acids that we eat have as much to do with this as yeast and shoe polish has to a bright start to the day!
Myth#2. This is the worst one, because it almost sounds credible. The argument is that the food as we eat it is irrelevant, and the important thing is what is left when the food is digested. This has lead to reams and reams of information about the ash content of food, measured by burning the food until all water is completely removed. Though it runs fairly close to my toast recipe, it has absolutely no relevance. This is the source of thousands of lists of acid and alkalizing food, and they are ALL wrong
To summarize, I believe that alkalizing is important for gouties and allopurinol takers, but it should not be an issue unless you have a particularly high protein diet, or like eating fireworks, matches or phosphate fertilizer. Dietary assessments give an indication of what foods should be beneficial. PRAL is a good estimate for individual foods, and there is a more accurate calculation called NEAP that assesses total daily intake. Though they give a fairly accurate assessment of your diet, to be certain of pH you can confirm it by peeing on testing paper.
(Apologies to zip2play for any wonky chemistry. In chemistry class I only woke up when our amazing science teacer threw sodium in water)
Thank you GP for your detailed response.
Oh blissful(?) , painful (!) IGNORANCE!!!
Why didn't I stay in my cave and keep on hibernating, just twitching my gouty joints in my dreams???
Keith, the answers you gave me were exactly the reason I asked my questions. I was already confused before, but each time I tried to learn more about pH, alkalizing, good/bad pH, etc., I wound up turning the puter off and saying words most people would not want to hear. (But they did keep my BP down since they work pretty well as relief valves.)
Now, with regard to negative pH (>7-14), I had been working on that when I started with the Ca Bentonite (See earlier posts.) Since it has a pH of ~9.5 its ingestion will have an impact on the body/blood/stomach,/urine pH, except, I don't know to what extent on each of them. Not having controlled/measured/researched/logged any pH values before, I don't have the foggiest idea where that leaves me.
I do tend to believe the statements that a body pH of 7.4 or so is the healthier one than any pH <7 where illnesses can and will dominate the body. We have so many sick people here in the States because of the food which the big (and small) food giants push down our throat, mostly acidic, and all the chemicals they add (for whatever reason) vastly contributes to that problem.
Hans- I've tried the diet proposed by Goutcare and it seems to work.
I see no reason to doubt that halving my UA in serum since a check last year is all down to tweaking my BP meds that can only manage 15% fall in trials, welcome though that reduction is.
You are already convinced that an alkaline diet is better than acid, with or without gout- and though the diet is quite hard to stick to, there are loads of tips. They will probably send it without a purchase- they are a good outfit, from my dealings with them.
I hope this advice helps- I have no connection with them -other than as a customer of their UA meter.
Thank you, Trev. I'll follow up on your suggestion. Had a problem, though, trying to print their pages.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.